BIKEPGH MESSAGE BOARD ARCHIVE

I don't understand why PA doesn't have radar. Makes no sense. And if a city wants to use it as a revenue generator, so be it. The info will get around and people will make sure not to speed. I grew up in CLE and a few suburbs were famous for speed traps. Then again, 99 percent of the time speeds are set because it is safe for the road and most cops will give you another 5-9 mph on top of the posted speed.

This is definitely something Pittsburgh has advocated for. They really think being able to use radar will make it easier to enforce the traffic laws. I'd be more convinced of that if I saw them trying to catch speeders with existing technology; it can't be that hard, I'd be happy to show them places to catch speeders, where to set up the timing points on the road, where to hide. But maybe having modern technology will make them want to try it out.

There's a lot of speed limit enforcement on Route65, in three zones, and nobody much speeds in those zones. It works. from Green Belt to I-79 from Sewickley Bridge to Emsworth (I think it's Emsworth) from Freedom to East Rochester

Actually, the stretch from Sewickley to Emsworth has significantly less local speed control than it used to. I'd still urge caution, but it's not the speed trap it used to be.

Was that enforcement provided by local or state police?

Looks like these bills moved forward a bit in the State Senate on Tuesday. I don't understand the details, but SB535 by Vulakovich (R-Allegheny) has been "Re-reported as committed" SB559 by Rafferty (R-Berks) has been "Re-reported as amended" So I think that means that they are out of committee and then will go to full vote shortly

The Trib printed a letter from a National Motorists Association member opposing this legislation (I think he's talking about the same bill). Referred to it as "anti-driver legislation". Imbecile! http://triblive.com/opinion/letters/11284421-74/legislation-anti-cameras

LOL, the all-powerful speed camera lobby! Idiot. Doesn't look like commenting is available. A shame.

the NMA is the NRA for cars

they may take that as a compliment.

You can comment on the article. But stupid responses outnumber sane ones by about a 2:1 margin. It's late. I'm not up to it right now.

Maybe instead of joining the stupid commentators, it would be a good idea to write your state legislator. Because there are many more motorists than bicyclists, so they're probably generating a lot of letters opposing red light cameras and radar. That's why we don't have them. If we don't speak up, they win.

The good news: The bill passed the Senate, 47-3, and heads to the House. The bad: However, the bill’s passage arrives late in the two-year legislation session, when the House has just six scheduled session days before Nov. 30, when all bills die http://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2016/10/19/senate-oks-bill-to-let-local-police-enforce-speed-with-radar/

Aand they're back! Vulakovich's SB 535 has been reintroduced this year as SB 251; all Allegheny County senators except Reschenthaler are co-sponsors: http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/billinfo/billinfo.cfm?syear=2017&sind=0&body=S&type=B&bn=251 Rafferty's SB 559 has been reintroduced this year as SB 279; Brewster and Costa are co-sponsors: http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/billinfo/billinfo.cfm?syear=2017&sind=0&body=S&type=B&bn=279

for those keeping track at home, SB 251 = radar for local law enforcement   Sb251 seems to allow for radar or lidar or what have you   you will need to be going 10 mph over or more to get a ticket. Local departments can only give warnings for those caught within the first 90 days of starting to use speed devices, and if the town makes more than 20 percent of their general revenue from the speed traps then the extra goes to the general fund of the state. SB 279 = Radar/LIDAR for Local Law Enforcement what I could glean from SB 279 is that jurisdictions would need to erect signs saying radar/lidar could be used, that they can only give tickets for more than 10 mph above the speed limit, and that if they are making more than 5% of their general budget from speeding tickets, the excess $$$ goes directly to PA State Police for training.

So, get in touch with your representative and tell them to vote for it. One thing that doesn't seem right is that the surplus should go to the general fund. Could it not go to something benefiting transportation? I personally would vote for transit. (I might even start to speed! Ok, not really.) And the 10 mph threshold doesn't seem quite right. Fifth Ave has a 35 mph limit (which is too high to start with). Is it really ok for cars to go 45 mph? That's scary (well, speaking for myself, as a biker occasionally on fifth). Though I could go with that limit dropping to 25 mph and letting drivers go only 35 mph...

No one wants to work for free, so my guess is that no matter what limit they set, they will make that amount of money or less. It is more to dissuade what we had in Cleveland growing up- some tiny suburbs that made huge amounts of money off of speeding that paid for most of their budget rather than any way to make any money for the state or state police.   If it is 5 percent, towns will make exactly 5 percent.

Which is exactly what Kilbuck Twp used to do along the half mile stretch of PA65 in their jurisdiction. They enforced the hell out of that, to the point the state cracked down on them.  Their defense was, hey, the law is the law, and we're enforcing the law, and writing tickets, and in 20 years, we have not had one speeding related fatality. It wasn't long after that that the ill fated Wal-Mart project was conceived to make money for the township. Every environmental regulation in the book was bypassed, resulting in a ten million dollar landslide in 2004 that closed PA65 for a month and even stopped train traffic.

How did they do the speed enforcement?  With the strips on the road?  I thought that's the only legal way for local PD to do speed enforcement right now.

That landslide area would be  prime to install a bike trail to connect to deer run road/kilbuck street to give an easier way to connect to sewickley.

edronline: Correct, locals have to use the stripes on the road. As far as the 10mph thing, i've heard that it's that high due to variability in how precise the equipment is. the thought being that 10mph over is high enough to rule out any false readings that can be challenged. just what i've been told though, no real evidence

I also think that 10 mph over might be the threshold for points vs not in the PA code?

Remember red light cameras?  Per this website they are law but as far as I can tell only Philly has rolled them out?   http://www.ghsa.org/state-laws/issues/Speed-and-Red-Light-Cameras

thinking about the 5% vs. 20% cap.  If you look at a boro like Fox Chapel, where I live, the budget is $7.5 million a year.  5% is $375,000.  If a ticket is typically $200 (I over estimated this, I'm sure) that's 1,875 tickets a year to make the 5% before it starts getting turned over to another body.  Or, 5 tickets every day.  If the average ticket is $150, then 7.5 tickets a day, and if it is $100, then 10 tickets a day. Pretty decent revenue stream even with 5%.  And that should be enough (5-10 tickets a day in a boro the size of Fox Chapel) to keep the police busy and for people to get the message that speed will be patrolled. Nearby ohara has a budget of $16.8million, so 5% is $840,000, or 4,200 tickets a year if they are $200 each, or 11.5 a day. Pittsburgh's 2017 budget is $539 million.  THAT'S a ton of tickets, even at 5% cap. (370 tickets a day at $200 a ticket) I bet if the higher cap is adopted, 20%, then there will be a lot of complaints about places becoming speed traps.  20% is a pretty significant portion of a budget...

^I like your ticket per day approach to the numbers. I'm sure a % of budget is probably a bad statistic to use.  It doesn't take into consideration the population of the district, the number of officers, nor the traffic volume traveling within/across the district.  A small town with a small budget might have a high volume highway passing through it like Killbuck mentioned above - so should they just sit back and allow folks to break the law?  Can you imagine the same politicians putting a cap on drugs? Theft?  Murder?  It just doesn't make sense.  They need to make sure that the speed limit law is being administered fairly & CORRECTLY, not how often.

It is up to each jurisdiction how much they want to enforce it. The state can't mandate enforcement. There is already a (crappy ass) speed control system available,but some jurisdictions could think that speeding isn't their biggest problem and that officers have bigger issues to deal with.  Others may see this as a cash grab and enforce for that reasons. Others may see this as "the right thing to do" and patrol to make streets safer.  OTOH, some residents may get angry about speed patrols in their neighborhood and push back on their police. Pretty much every state already allows for radar and lidar for local PDs and I'm sure enforcement varies widely across the US.